it seems luqman arnold is on the verge of pulling out of bidding for northern rock,cant say i blame him seen as he isnt getting the same treatment as virgin money in terms of bidding for northern rock!!

Another intresting update

It has been reported that THE VIRGIN DEAL ITSELF may or may not be in danger ,the reason being is because deutche bank have reported to have cooled on the idea of supporting the takeover financially not because of the credit crisis,the reason why is not available but it could be because there are still a large amount of withdrawals going on at northern rock ,making the business a unsuitable proposition for a takeover the longer it goes on.

Update..

Apparently the group led by albert luqman maybe in danger of pulling out,as they are struggling to get equal treatment from the northern rock board,this doesnt mean virgin are gonna be able to compelte the deal as 2 of the biggest shareholders in northern rock are big american finance companys who are more favourable to the terms set out by albert luqmans consortium,in that they offer better long terms benefits to the shareholders in question and more,plus if you read into certain details of their bid,it appears they offer   4 billion more  than virgin repayment upfront of the TAX PAYERS cash it lent from the treasury,with the rest being repayed over the same amount of years as the proposed virgin offer.

I must admit it does seem strange than the northern rock board are allowing this takeover to slow down a bit,makes me think that in spite of what albert luqmans consortium may or may not offer,it appears they wont be getting the same chance as virgin in this bidding more.

Is this good business practice for northern rock,surely it needs to examine all bids and allow all bidders who have proof of funds the same acesses to their books.

Thanks for giving me a bit more info on that,and your post baout the business model of northern rock proves that it was a mis-management issue aswell as the credit crisis in the us. 

Ive never made a saint of luqman arnold as i must admit i dont know the guy or much of his background,but if the man is widely accreditedby people who work in the city stock markets as being the man who turned abbey around and if the same people and the important sections of the media view him as better than richard branson,then surely thats puts him in a better light.

Of course whenever you try and turn a business around,one of the main things the new owners too is focus on cost saving drives,like the redunancy of staff of streamlining of other departments,which is not a bad thing business wise,if in the end the business continues to grow and make a healthy profit.

Im going through the same thing at my place of work,only that i believe it will be a good thing in the end,wouldnt be too sure if it was richard branson that had just took the company i work for over.

Breaking news from yesterday..lol i like that one

Northern rock is coming under huge pressure to give luqman arnold due dillegence over the books .

Apparently the treasury dont seem to be against this,lets wait and see what happens.

The reason why other banks have not stepped in is because they are not clear to them that there is enough money to be made to make a proposed takeover worthwhile.

Let me state at the outset that I am not a huge proponent of Richard Branson (or a huge opponent either). I am personally happy for ANY suitable institution able to rescue the Rock to come in and take it over, including Luqman Arnold's Olivant consortium.

But it's worth pointing out that:

a) Northern Rock is moribund. Some £10bn and counting of its savers' cash has been withdrawn in the past few weeks, out of £30bn in total. The bank has borrowed more than £25bn from the BoE in order to refinance its debts, incurred after its business model was shot to pieces by the credit crisis in the US. Rock's mortgage assets may be worth £100bn, but that's what its lending is secured on. What the bank gets from that is an income stream - mortgage repayments - which it turns out may well be less than the interest it has to pay in turn to the wholesale markets that lent it the money advanced on those mortgages.

b) Virgin Money is not totally insignificant. Sure, it is smaller than Northern Rock is, or was. But the company has significant experience in the mortgage market, credit cards, unit trusts and savings aas well as life assurance.

c) Luqman Arnold is not a saint. He made his name at Abbey, in the course of which the National part of the name was dumped, thousands of jobs were lost there and that bank's central premise of "turning banking upside down" were a miserable failure. The "rescue" of Abbey was unproven and one might well argue that Luqman was lucky Santander, which was seeking a suitable bid target in the UK, came in and took it off his hands.

As I said, I have no problems with anyone who wants to move in. But let's not make saints or sinners out of any potential bidders for the Rock.

Let get back to the subject now,

If anyone has a view on the takeover please fee free to post and say who you think is good company to bid for northern rock,personally i cant understand why any of the big uk banks in operation here have not put forward a bid.

i'm sure it was you who was moaning and complaining the other day that you are being picked on and under-valued all because people put you back into your tiny little space. Who died and made you an over-night expert with all your waffling you wake up to do on the forum...??

here's something for your "broad" mind to ponder on: there is a significant difference between OWNERSHIP and RUNNING of a company. Dont mix up the two, they can be very different...

Oh well thats five seconds of my life il never get back reading that stupid post!!

Thin you will find i get good replys from advice given.

Branson is a good business man ive never doubted that,but for the third time and i reckon 90% of the city will agree,luqman arnold is better qualified to run northen rock if the terms for his offer are the same as virgin money,minus the draconian payouts the small investors have to make to keep their stake in northern rock.

i see that seem to be threated by facts. not so many posts ago you were kindly advised to read what you write before you post, i see the "advice" fell on deaf ears [what a shame]!!

Branson owns the Virgin brand, he has people of adiquate capacity to run Virgin money. as a single individual, he has managed to aquire such a vast empire to the extent of being a multi-billionaire and if that is a stupid business model to grow from then i'll have the same any day!!

a good 90% of your 6445 points come from random chants [of which you have been advised of] yet you still persist, i dont honestly think i'm in the mood to waste my time arguing with you in a bid to boost your points...

sorry...

I like the way you put that sharkey,i just hope that luqman albert gets it as i believe he offers the best chance of bringing northern rock back to the billion pound business it was previously valued at.

I'm just worried that every Virgin Media contract will come with a mortgage contract. Not sure that Branson hasn't gone a little too far here. The shareholders will veto it anyway so the chances of it happening are pretty slim - and when I say "The Shareholders" I mean the BIG boys who don't even live in the UK ... smaller shareholders will be slam-dunked by the others anyhow.

SHARK! 

Sounds like a threat. 

Sorry not gonna happen,i stand by my view on richard branson i never said he wasnt a good business man i just said his brand is not very experianced on the banking sector and he should really concentrate on growing his own virgin business instead of trying to takeover a much bigger company than his own brand.

And if YOU READ THE NEWS,the bid from luqman arnold is likely to be on the same terms as the virgin money deal,i dont think the government and the bank of england would approve such a bid if the offer of repayment wasnt as good as the virgin money offer,incidently i reckon the NR small shareholders will try to block the virgin deal as according to the terms of offer they have stump up £750 to retain the same stake they have,that will be difficult for some,plus the money virgin have offered is not a true reflection of the companys worth.

Plus the problems with northern rock were of the companys own doing aswell as the global credit problems caused by the us sub-prime morgage market,complete mis management by their own chief exec

Red Army.

i would very much like to differ with your somewhat short-sighted assumption!! the situation Northern Rock is in is not a mis-management issue, if you watch and listen to the news you'll find that its more of a cash-flow crisis. the problem started in September when the world credit markets dried up. Fianancial institutes will choose to borrow money from abroad as the interest rates they'll pay back are lower than those charged by the BoE.

Put personal feelings aside [because in the business world feeling will always cloud your better judgement and decision-makng], what Richard Branson is offering to do is help ease the cash-flow problem by paying off £11bn of the £25bn borrowed from the BoE, then the remaining £14bn over the next 3yrs. further on top of that, £1.3bn will be injected into Northern Rock for lending purposes. How much is Arnold going to inject into Northern Rock apart from a shining CV...??

as a shareholder, would you rather lose almost everything or make best with what you've got...??

if i was you Mr Red Army i'd retract your last statement...

Richard Branson has too many fingers in too many pies,he might be a billionaire with years of business experiance but the crucial thing is virgin money is not a whole financial services opertaion,it makes tin-pot profit compared to northern rock and his offer for that business just goes to show what a sneaky person he really is.

Can he be really trusted not to announce major job cuts after he has taken over.

The fact is if i was a northern rock shareholder,i would do my upmost to block any virgin money bid,and would really prefer the possible second bid headed by  luqman arnold arnold the former  chief exec of the abbey,this guy has years of banking and finance experiance and was credited in the city with saving the abbey from going down the pan.

Now you dont need to be a banking expert to work out who would be best fit to run northern rock.

The proposed Virgin takeover of Northern Rock may be in doubt as a key investor says it will oppose the deal. Rab Capital, the second-largest shareholder in Northern Rock, believes Virgin Group's bid for the bank is too low. Moneysupermarket.com Editor Nic Cicutti reports...

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