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Shared ownership mortgages

Last post Wed, Feb 11 2009, 12:35 AM by BG. 34 replies.
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  •  Tue, Dec 23 2008, 2:31 PM

    Shared ownership mortgages

    Quick question. Property is valued at £210,000. 50% share is £105,000. How does this affect looking for a mortgage.

    Would you have to look at 90% mortgage and would you need deposit - but bearing in mind you are only financing 50% of the value of the property can you look at other mortgages with offer much better terms?

    • Post Points: 35
  •  Tue, Dec 23 2008, 10:57 PM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    Different lenders will have different attitudes. A mortgage advisor can give you information that is specific to your situation.

    I would expect that if the rent on the 50% that isn't yours was more than the mortgage on the other half, some lenders would see your situation as less appealing than if it wasn't a part-owned property.

    To get the best deals, you need a decent deposit these days.

    • Post Points: 20
  •  Tue, Dec 23 2008, 11:08 PM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    ElaineMarie, I'm curious to know what attracts you to shared ownership property? Is it that you like the idea of owning something or "getting a foot on the ladder" but can't afford a conventional mortgage?

    Can I ask what sort of rental amount you have to pay for the 50% (£105k)?

    Only if you don't mind stating of course!



    • Post Points: 20
  •  Wed, Dec 24 2008, 9:33 AM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    We helped my son buying a part buy house. The building societies are not keen on them! If you don't keep up repayments what do they take back! Your right to rent 50% of the house! The housing association will give you advice on where you might get a mortgage. Don't think because you are paying £105,000 for a £210,000 that you are in a strong position! A deposit will still be needed! However,my son would not have a house but for this scheme.
    • Post Points: 5
  •  Wed, Dec 24 2008, 10:20 AM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    Rental is about £300 but this includes £90 service charge as it is a Do it yourself shared ownership. A 3 bed flat on the River which is lovely and has a live in caretaker and beautiful communal gardens. I want to sell it on to my son as I own 50%.

    This seems to be the only way he could get on the property ladder but I do feel shared ownership is not as good as it is cracked up to be, the winner is definitely the housing association!!! He is struggling as he only has a 5% deposit at present and I am trying to find out if there are any 95% shared ownership mortgages out there, but this is proving difficult at present.

    There are many downsides to shared ownership and i only recommend it as a last resort.

    They overvalue property but people fall for it as they only need to finance 50%.

    I spent £15K on this flat upgrading flat - they get half the profit on increased value.

    I pay commission to them to sell it based on the whole value! And so on,.......

    How this scheme is helping young people is beyond me. The FSA should take a look maybe as it does not appear the housing authorities are acting in the interests of their clients and they do not advise them properly.

    The only good point is that if the housing authority can't sell it in 8 weeks then I can sell it on the open market and I could if I want staircase to full 100% and sell at the same time. Luckily this is a desirable property and I do have alot of interest in it.

    I feel that if it gets my son on the ladder and he moves in a couple of years, it will save him spending £1000 per month renting a house which is what he pays now......

    What were your views?

    • Post Points: 20
  •  Wed, Dec 24 2008, 2:04 PM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    Thanks for that ElaineMarie, very interesting. Personally I've never seen any merit for the tenant/buyer in shared ownership except emotionally it seems to satisfy some sort of need to own something. Financially I see it as a hole someone else owns and controls who will let you fill it in for them, or dig deeper whenever you want.

    If he's going to borrow £105k even at say just 5% then over 25 years on repaymernt basis then it'll cost around £613 per month, add to that the £300 rent and you could see it as he's £87 per month better off than renting at rate he does now.

    It's important for anyone in his position to realise they're taking on a massive liability (and definitely not an asset), particularly at this time when the next couple of years are potentially so volatile. In about 5 years time, the capital element of his mortgage will have reduced by about £13k or so. So he'll still owe more than £90k on a house that he only half owns that is very unlikely to be worth much more (if any) than it was on day one. At any time in the process if the tide turns for the worse, the HA can always get someone else to continue filling in that hole for them. In a nutshell, it's not really a 50/50 split, but I think you already know that. All the best anyway.



    • Post Points: 20
  •  Wed, Dec 24 2008, 2:42 PM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    By the same logic why would anyone ever rent. At least on these schemes someone can get a foot on the bottom rung of the ladder. If you think the property market is going to fall then renting for a period might be of benefit. However, I think you miss the point of these schemes. They are to help low paid workers get a place. My son had no hope of ever buying. However, with our help he has made it to the first rung and will hopefully manage at some point to buy the rest.

    Can I ask if you have ever seen one of these 'holes' as you describe! My son has a very smart looking 2 bedroomed detached house!

    • Post Points: 20
  •  Mon, Dec 29 2008, 9:49 PM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    Hi Kev, sorry for putting your nose out of joint as that certainly wasn't my intention! We all have our own views on the way to do things and as I've honestly never come across a shared-ownership scheme with pro-rata "risks versus rewards", I was curious what attracted ElaineMarie (or anyone else) towards it that's all.

    Please appreciate my reference to filling/digging holes etc was in no way a description or criticism of any property, but instead purely an attempt to use an analogy to represent the way the finance is structured and who is saddled with the liability (as in my opinion it's far from the 50/50 split it's made out to be).

    I don't see it as anything like the same logic as purely renting as there's no liability involved with renting (nor nothing wrong with it either). I've promoted an alternative solution for people such as your son elsewhere on this forum previously, in the shape of "Rent to Own", which offers far more than any HA scheme, but with zero liabilty for the first few years (ie they can hand the keys back and walk away at any time, if things don't pan out as expected).

    Just to stress again, I'm not attacking anyone for choosing any HA scheme, I'm just pointing out (as ElaineMarie quoted herself) "it's not all it's cracked up to be", and there are alternatives, they're just not as well-known that's all.

    Be lucky ;o)



    • Post Points: 20
  •  Tue, Dec 30 2008, 10:50 AM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    Thanks for your comments. Very interesting. What exactly is Rent to Own?

    One problem I find with the government schemes is that they are not very well advertised and the process is never explained properly for young people to understand all the issues. Shared ownership is a way into the housing market but I would not recommend it to anyone. My situation was that after a divorce it was the only way I could buy another property, however I have lost out financially and the housing association have certainly come off best! I have to pay for a lease extension and I have paid £15K for improvements all of which the HA will receive 50% profit from significantly increased value of property. I would have been better off putting my money away two years ago and renting! My feelings are:

    1. HA overvalue properties, especially new ones.

    2. Any improvements you make and pay for which increase value of property, the HA will get half the profit on sale.

    3.HA require leaseholder to incur all the costs of selling yet leaseholder has no say about how they sell it. I am selling a shared ownership and have lost the property I wanted as it took the HA two months to sort out valuation (the one they gave me reflected the wrong lease and had to be redone); I had to pay for the valuation yet until I asked HA for it I never got it! I have had to sort the lease out myself and will have to pay full cost for lease extension (£10K) although no one advised me the lease would be a problem and HA will not pay half. I have a shared ownership underlease and I don't understand what this really means and why if the head lease was under 70 years and an issue, it was not extended when I bought the flat. On my sale I have to pay commission on full value (over £2.5K) to housing association to sell.

    4. We have wasted 2 months as HA 8 weeks nomination period only starts when I sign confirmation of sale (their details which I signed the day I got them!). I pay all the costs, yet I have to take all the calls and do all the viewings myself, and even send them a list of viewings. Surely, they should pay me commission....

    5. Morgages are more difficult to get for shared ownership, in fact many building societies have withdrawn them as they don't like the risk. Mortgages are difficult enough for young people now having to find a 10% deposit but HA will not help by offering anything off-market.

    6. Another thing I have learned is that even though purchaser will be exempt from stamp duty on first £175K he buys, when he staircases, it is reassessed for stamp duty and once over the threshold he will have to pay it all. I don't think this is explained to shared ownership leaseholders.

    What concerns me is that I am reasonably intelligent and have worked in conveyancing so I have a basic understanding of the process.Young people are attracted to shared ownership becasue they are desperate to buy a property (not sure why at present but this is still the culture in this country) and are drawn to shared ownership without understanding it at all. The HA give very limited advice which is very biased and in my experience, not always correct!

    Elaine

    • Post Points: 20
  •  Tue, Dec 30 2008, 3:15 PM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    I don't agree with some of your comments. 1) You are not forced to buy a HA property. If it is too dear walk away. 2. My understanding is that if you point out the improvements made they are ignored from the valuation. 3. Sounds as if your original solicitor made an error when buying the property, maybe should ask them why they didn't query the lease. 4. If you use an estate agent you often do the viewings! 5. Yes it is more difficult. 6. No that is not correct. You can opt to pay the stamp duty on the full purchase price when you buy it. If it is below £175,000 then there is no stamp duty and none when you staircase. I got the Inland Revenue to confirm this was the case to both the HA and my sons Solicitor as they did not believe me!

    It sounds as if you are unhappy with the way things have gone. However, I think it is a way of a young person getting a place. My son had no hope as his wages were too low. We helped him out and would have been unable to do so under other circumstances.

    As with any transaction you need to be wary and make sure it is the right one for you. Better luck next time.

    I would like to know more about rent to own?

    • Post Points: 20
  •  Wed, Dec 31 2008, 10:54 AM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    I agree that I was a bit naive when I purchased my lease, the point I was making is that young people do not understand these things, they rely on professional advice. The properties are over valued but as it is the only way in for some of us we have to go with that, it would be difficult to contest the valuation as it is a RICS valuation.

    Improvements are ignored when you sell the property, although they are taken into account if you staircase. Not sure why this rule applies but it does.

    I agee you could pay all stamp duty up front. My sale price is £210K so the purchaser could pay the stamp duty on the whole amount but he may never staircase? He is buying 50% at £105,000. The point is that if he staircases he will have to pay stamp duty and this was not explained to him by the HA. The HA also gave me incorrect advice on my lease until I made them refer me to their legal department.

    As I work full time and it takes me 1.5 hours to get home I have previously trusted an agent with a key to my property and let them do the viewings, its what I pay them for. Also, all the properties I have looked at to buy recently have been with an agent and not the occupier. With HA I have to do the viewings and I have limited availability.

    For some people shared ownership is the only way into the market and this can be a good thing, it is just a shame that the scheme favours the HA and young people are not always given the right advice and I just wonder who supervises Housing Authorities?

    • Post Points: 20
  •  Sat, Jan 03 2009, 6:09 AM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    ElaineMarie: What exactly is Rent to Own?


    kev2006n: I would like to know more about rent to own?


    It’s a fairly simple concept that’s been popular for years in Austrailia and parts of US. I’ll explain the basics here but for the benefit of the moderators I’ll stress I’m not trying to sell this to anyone as a product, I just see it as a great alternative, particularly for first time buyers. Please bear in mind I've cut and pasted this from another document (of my own) so some of the figures may be slightly out of date now and the formatting isn't ideal.


    1. You find your desired property just as you would normally. Only difference is seller will be offering it as a “Rent to Own” either directly or through an intermediary with knowledge of how to process such a transaction (your average Estate Agent wouldn’t be geared up do this). Seller may be on market as normal or he may be advertising to let to tenant as normal, so will usually add ‘Rent to Own’ as a further option.


    2. You’ll negotiate a purchase price just as you would normally and you’ll also agree a monthly rental amount (as you’ll be renting prior to owning it).


    3. You’ll negotiate an ‘option’ period which could be any period you like, but typically will be between 2 and 5 years. So if it’s 5 years then you’ll have the exclusive option to buy the property outright at ANY time (to suit YOU or YOUR circumstances) within the next 5 years. The only condition is you must rent the property in the interim period until you are ready to buy it.


    4. The prime advantage for the buyer is that they can choose their first home, precisely as they would in the “traditional” way, but they don’t actually have to buy it until just prior to the option period expiring (although they are completely free to buy it sooner if they so wish). There are many real spin-offs from this advantage such as –


    (a) imagine a young couple, really excited etc at the outset but within 2 or 3 years things go a bit stale, or she gets pregnant, or he loses his job, or they find they don’t like the area, or they don’t get on with the neighbours, or the roof falls in etc etc. A multitude of possible scenarios and at the end of the day, if they want to end the agreement they just give a months notice as per the tenancy agreement and hand back the keys with no debts to settle or creditors to chase them. Just think for a moment how different the financial implications could be had they bought the property outright at day one and signed up for a fixed rate mortgage, and maybe the property could even be worth less than they paid for it. Any of this sound feasible?


    (b) Many young people simply can’t afford the commitment of a mortgage on the amount they earn today, but those with career prospects (may or may not be new graduates) can see their earning power increasing rapidly within 5 years. Trouble is the market may have run further away from them by then. Sound familiar? So wouldn’t it be a good thing if they could reserve a property at todays price until they’re ready to buy it


    (c) Many on good incomes are too young to have built up a healthy enough credit rating to enable them to get the most competitive mortgage products. They could secure something now, defer buying for a few years and save an excess amount towards a bigger deposit when the time comes.


    (d) Foreign migrant workers choosing to settle in UK also come across similar credit rating issues which excludes them from the best mortgage deals. Deferring a purchase gives them time to build this up.


    (e) Lots of divorcees come away with good financial settlements but poor credit rating due to a bad history through past defaults. As with the previous points, deferring the purchase gives them enough breathing space to be able to rebuild their credit profile.


    (f) Plenty more scenarios but you get the picture I’m sure..


    5. But why would a seller freeze the price at todays rate when he may be able to get a lot more in say 5 years time?


    (a) The seller want’s to sell. If they sell today they’ll get todays price. If they sell in 5 years to someone who’ll rent continuously until then, they’ll have a guaranteed positive cash-flow for each month until that time comes. The seller has effectively got a guaranteed buyer lined up who’s willing to pay rent on time until such time as they can buy outright.


    (b) The seller will charge an ‘Option’ fee to the tenant/buyer – typically between 3% and 5% of the agreed purchase price, which he (the seller) will keep if the buyer defaults on the rental agreement of fails to exercise the option to buy


    6. So the prospective tenant/buyer has to pay an ‘Option’ fee?

    Yes, because without that, the tenant/buyer would be no different to any “ordinary” tenant, in that he could simply stop paying his rent, trash the property and leave the seller high and dry. The option fee is really a form of commitment from the tenant/buyer and is usually (but not always) refunded (deducted off agreed purchase price) when the property sale is completed.


    In some cases there may also be supplemental monthly payments above the rental amount and these would usually (but not always) be credited against eventual purchase price.


    The object of the exercise is for the tenant/buyer to have sufficient funds in place to enable a purchase towards the end of the option period. If they are simply left to save that amount voluntarily then there’s a much greater chance of the plan failing. If on the other hand they make a formal commitment to pay either an ‘Option’ fee, enhanced rental amounts, or a combination of both, then that’s their commitment to making the plan viable and sustainable.


    Consider a scenario of a tenant/buyer couple paying say a 3% option fee on a property worth £150k (so they’d need to find £4,500 up front). After 5 years if things don’t work out for them they can walk away having paid market rent (which they’d have paid anywhere else anyway) plus they’d have lost £4,500. Yes that’s pretty bad but not half as bad as a break-up with a new mortgage in tow. On the other hand, if the market moves in the right direction in that 5 year period (fingers crossed for 2014) the property could be worth a lot more than £150k so they can still sell their ‘Option’ to but to someone else.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------


    Finally, here’s a maths comparison for 2 identical houses side by side to give an idea on how the numbers compare between a "traditional" purchase and a sample 5 year ‘Option’ scenario –

    Mr & Mrs Nervous buy their house today for the market value of £120,000

    They pay a mortgage application fee (£250), a valuation fee (£250) and a Homebuyers Report (£600)


    They pay a 5% deposit (£6,000), a Higher Lending Charge (£1,000), Legal Fees (£750) and take on a 95% mortgage for £114,000

    They pay £769.74 per month towards a 25 year repayment mortgage at an interest rate of 6.5%


    Finally, here’s a maths comparison for 2 identical houses side by side to give an idea on how the numbers compare between a "traditional" purchase and a sample 5 year ‘Option’ scenario –

    Mr & Mrs Nervous buy their house today for the market value of £120,000

    They pay a mortgage application fee (£250), a valuation fee (£250) and a Homebuyers Report (£600)


    They pay a 5% deposit (£6,000), a Higher Lending Charge (£1,000), Legal Fees (£750) and take on a 95% mortgage for £114,000

    They pay £769.74 per month towards a 25 year repayment mortgage at an interest rate of 6.5%

    They pay a mortgage application fee (£250), a valuation fee (£250) and a Homebuyers Report (£600)


    They pay a 5% deposit (£6,000), a Higher Lending Charge (£1,000), Legal Fees (£750) and take on a 95% mortgage for £114,000

    They pay £769.74 per month towards a 25 year repayment mortgage at an interest rate of 6.5%

    They pay £769.74 per month towards a 25 year repayment mortgage at an interest rate of 6.5%


    In 5 years time, assuming a constant rate, they’ll have paid out £46,184 towards their mortgage, plus approx £8,850 for deposit and associated fees, so a grand total of £55,034



    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Mr & Mrs Happy sign an ‘Option’ to buy the house next door, for £120,000 at any time over the next 5 years and agree to pay a 3% fee for the privilege (£3,600)


    Instead of paying £769 mortgage like their neighbours, they pay £600 per month rent and they save £150 per month towards their future deposit.



    In 5 years time, assuming a constant rate, they’ll have paid out £36,000 in rent, plus £3,600 for the ‘Option’ to buy at a guaranteed fixed price that was agree 5 years previously. In addition they’ll have £9,000 saved towards their mortgage.



    In 5 years time Mr & Mrs Happy will be £24,434 better off than their nervous neighbours, having spent £15,434 less and with £9,000 in the bank.


    Now Mrs & Mrs Happy are entirely free to choose whether to go ahead and buy their home (if it suits their circumstances at the time), or they can sell their guarantee to a third party for an immediate cash profit, or they can just walk away if they wish. This flexible choice will have cost them just £3,600; so even if they chose to walk away, they’d still be £20,834 better off financially than their neighbours.



    • Post Points: 50
  •  Mon, Jan 05 2009, 7:21 PM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    I am curious. I have a shared ownership deal which I got in Dec 2007- have been here for a year. I bought 40 pc of the property. I'm waiting to purchase the other 60 pc as the property prices come down. Is that such a bad thing?

    To Elaine Marie- wouldn't it be better if you waited a while before purchasing the rest of your property as you might get a better deal on it if re value it later in the year when prices might be lower.

    Lastly, I'm slightly confused about the lease issue. Mine had a 125 year lease on it when I bought it- is there an issue with the leases on these properties if you re mortgage to buy the rest?

    • Post Points: 20
  •  Tue, Jan 06 2009, 12:14 PM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    Your lease is excellent, you have well over 100 years on it. The problem I have is that HA created a shared ownership sublease on a property I chose to buy and the head lease had less than 70 years remaining. For me to sell it now it needs to be extended as it lost significant value when the lease reduced below 70 years. I was never advised about this and was a bit naive when I bought. My lease extension will cost £10K and housing authority refuse to contribute even though they get the benefit of half the value as the property will be worth £20K more when I do the lease extension!

    I want to buy with my partner and get out of shared ownership, he does not want to buy into it as we want to buy a larger property and he does not like concept of shared ownership.

    I am just frustrated that I have to pay for everything and shared ownership is not quite what I thought...

    I think you are right though, wait a bit and buy the other 60%, then you are out of shared ownership altogether.

    • Post Points: 20
  •  Tue, Jan 06 2009, 9:25 PM

    Re: Shared ownership mortgages

    Just wondering, were in a property where our landlord origionally intended to sell. Considering the market he decided to rent it out. Would we be able to approach him suggesting this?

    • Post Points: 5
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