Hello Dai

I'm sorry to hear you've decided to leave our forum, before you go I want to clarify a few things:

i) We've had compliance and legal advice in relation to what you say about passing postcode information in a public forum and it's been confirmed there is NO security risk from an identity perspective - however in light of what you've said we're going to implement a couple of measures to ensure the forum is more aware of these issues.

ii) We do not capture user data with the intention of using it for marketing purposes - if we did we would need 'opt in' permission to do so.

iii) We are in the process of developing a comparison tool that will list every deal in the market, irrespective of whether the provider has a deal in place with us or not. As said before in order to keep the channel free to users and so that we can develop new tools and functionality we charge providers a commission for any business introduced.

If you have any comments or queries pls respond to this post or email me direct on jason.lloyd @ moneysupermarket.com

Kind Regards

Jason Lloyd

An idiotic and absolutely stupid response!!!! I've shown these forums to several seasoned security experts and they are shocked by what's going on here. I could post things about here that even you had forgotten about or didn't know. I don't need tpo pay for LR searches either..... And neither do the scammers and criminals of this world.

If you believe what you've just written you are a fool. But, I suspect the real reason for asking for such info is that MS is compiling a very lucrative database of those who are foolish enough to impart such information and it won't be long before that database is up for sale.

As for advice regarding broadband suppliers well, that's even worse. If an ISP doesn't pay MS a kickback then they don't get a mention. It's an absolutely disgraceful way to treat the general public who put their trust in you.

Please remove my details from your database. You won't be hearing from me again..... But, I shall be doing my damnest to warn Joe Public about this.

Independent advice my backside!

Michael Harper:Hello Daniel306, Please don't worry; posting your post code won't result in Identity fraud. Information on anyone can be pulled from many sources. If I wanted to pay I could run a land registry search which would pull up more information but why bother. None of this can be used to do anything. My post code is CH66 3JL I bank with Lloyds and Natwest, I am married with a little girl - all this is very interesting but also mostly publicly available. If anyone has any genuine concern then simply email me at Michael.Harper at Moneysupermarket.com with their post code instead of posting. Your details are not kept without your say so. As for Sam Knows, moneysupermarket has a strong relationship Sam Crawford (the owner of sam knows). We use this because we can be assured that data entered is not used. As for BT - as a previous employ of said company I can say they are not that bad to work for, as a customer of BT in the past I can say they have far to come. I am personally a happy customer of TalkTalk a direct competitor to BT although the free broadband offer has resulted in many unhappy cases, from experience this pales in comparison to the experience recived from any ex Government Company, BT, British Gas, British Rail - (please note this is simply my personal opinion) Daniel - I don't wish to insinuate that as you lived in Australia you know allot about larger but I am a 1664 man my self what is your preference? All the best Mike.

 No offence taken! I'm a very rare creature indeed. An Australian who doesn't drink! Haven't had a drink for about 3 years and before then it was only on very rare occasions.

I didn't really think that there was any risk of identity fraud to be honest. Lloyds for one are anal about data protection and I couldn't even get access to my account once over the phone without physically having my card in front of me even though I could rattle off so many personal details it wasn't funny and they refused to call my girlfriend (I work 9-5 so taking calls at work is difficult to say the least) up in regards to my account even though she's a Lloyds customer and I said that I authorised her to deal with anything in regards to my account.

 There are so many easier targets for identity fraud and it's easier just to skim details of cards at ATM's than to break into our house and get our mail and try and impersonate one of us. But that's just me ;-)

Hello Daniel306,

Please don't worry; posting your post code won't result in Identity fraud. Information on anyone can be pulled from many sources.
If I wanted to pay I could run a land registry search which would pull up more information but why bother. None of this can be used to do anything.
My post code is CH66 3JL I bank with Lloyds and Natwest, I am married with a little girl - all this is very interesting but also mostly publicly available. If anyone has any genuine concern then simply email me at Michael.Harper at Moneysupermarket.com with their post code instead of posting. Your details are not kept without your say so.

As for Sam Knows, moneysupermarket has a strong relationship Sam Crawford (the owner of sam knows). We use this because we can be assured that data entered is not used.

As for BT - as a previous employ of said company I can say they are not that bad to work for, as a customer of BT in the past I can say they have far to come. I am personally a happy customer of TalkTalk a direct competitor to BT although the free broadband offer has resulted in many unhappy cases, from experience this pales in comparison to the experience recived from any ex Government Company,
BT, British Gas, British Rail - (please note this is simply my personal opinion)

Daniel - I don't wish to insinuate that as you lived in Australia you know a lot about lager but I am a 1664 man my self what is your poison?

All the best

Mike.

Dai Young:

Daniel306:

[Samknows is the best tool available to Michael and that's what he uses. Do you expect him to not help people just because samknows isn't 100% accurate.

 Also I fail to see how submitting someone's postcode over the internet is a huge security risk at all.

Did I say anything about not helping folk or not using the resource???? I urged caution as its database can get things quite wrong - No more and no less. As I've asked of you before, please learn to read what's in front of you before attempting to discredit others. And actually, it's not the best resource of this type that's available.

If you can't see how advertising your postcode on a public forum is not a security risk then you need to take a look at the big bad world that exists outside that cosy little North Welsh shell of yours!

I haven't bothered to look for your postcode but if it's available, I could pinpoint exactly where you live and then use several databases at my disposal to obtain your name, your girlfriends name and full details etc etc etc. Throw a little social engineering into the pot and I could easily become you as far as the outside world is concerned.

Wake up and smell the lager! ;-]]

This is not a dig at you in particular; it's an illustration to all of how careful you need to be.

 

Great! If someone tracks me down and gives me broadband advice in the street I'll know who it is.

I take your point and agree that you have to be careful how much information you give out on the net but giving your postcode out only gives people a general indication of where you live.

P.S North Wales is a big place and I'm not the only 20 something Australian here ;-)

Daniel306:

[Samknows is the best tool available to Michael and that's what he uses. Do you expect him to not help people just because samknows isn't 100% accurate.

 Also I fail to see how submitting someone's postcode over the internet is a huge security risk at all.

Did I say anything about not helping folk or not using the resource???? I urged caution as its database can get things quite wrong - No more and no less. As I've asked of you before, please learn to read what's in front of you before attempting to discredit others. And actually, it's not the best resource of this type that's available.

If you can't see how advertising your postcode on a public forum is not a security risk then you need to take a look at the big bad world that exists outside that cosy little North Welsh shell of yours!

I haven't bothered to look for your postcode but if it's available, I could pinpoint exactly where you live and then use several databases at my disposal to obtain your name, your girlfriends name and full details etc etc etc. Throw a little social engineering into the pot and I could easily become you as far as the outside world is concerned.

Wake up and smell the lager! ;-]]

This is not a dig at you in particular; it's an illustration to all of how careful you need to be.

Edited in line with Terms of Service
Community Editor

Dai Young:

Please don't put too much faith in SamKnows. It's a very good resource indeed but it's far from infallible.

Do you really think it's a good idea security wise to ask users to submit their postcodes to an open forum? I certainly don't!

Samknows is the best tool available to Michael and that's what he uses. Do you expect him to not help people just because samknows isn't 100% accurate.

 Also I fail to see how submitting someone's postcode over the internet is a huge security risk at all.

Please don't put too much faith in SamKnows. It's a very good resource indeed but it's far from infallible.

Do you really think it's a good idea security wise to ask users to submit their postcodes to an open forum? I certainly don't!

Hi Mauritius77,

In answer to your question moneysupermarket.com uses www.samknows.com as this site is not ran or owned by any ISP it is independent. This will give a list of results for available LLU suppliers and speeds, it can even check the results against your post code to determine what that group of houses should be able to get.

Hope this helps,

Mike.

Now now children...

As I said it is pointless arguing with you.

My only statement would be that I certainly do agree that you have at some time worked for the BT group as you are exhibiting trademark BT group aggresion and rudeness.

Daniel306:There's not point in having a discussion with you at all.

That is your prerogative.

Daniel306:I asked if you had any evidence of speedtest.net giving erroneous results to which you replied that it's sponsored by NamesCo which insinuates that they would somehow skew the results to favour them (how I don't know?!?!?!?!).

First of all, my contribution in this regard insinuates nothing of the sort - That you imagine this is your problem and no-one elses.
Secondly, it is a simple matter to skew speed test results to favour a certain IP group or groups.

Daniel306:..... which is clearly not the case in my experience......

And that experience is?

Daniel306:Perhaps you would earn more credibility by not being so rude and dismissive in regards to ideas that other people present. After all this is a forum where people come for help, not to have their ideas dismissed and derided by yourself.

I will not aplogise for being dismissive of misleading and erroneous information! As for helping others I suggest that you peruse my contributions to this and other boards.

Daniel306:You also said that ISP's will always dismiss results produced while using speedtest.net which is clearly not the case in my experience.

According to your own admission, these test results were accepted by the BT group. Having worked at a very high level within the BT group, I can tell you now that you were fobbed off or simply lied to. It is official BT policy that the results from the BT speedtest alone are considered in any case. There are very good reasons for this that do not involve fraud or self interest.
Moreover, this policy and these reasons apply to all BT IPStream based ISPs although some less than honest providers will attempt to claim otherwise (See the reference to skewed results above).
If you don't believe this or require further clarification, search for the relevant SIN document.

Daniel306:Drop the attitude and try and be helpful rather than just being rude. Everyone can get along fine if we just play nice.

I get very annoyed when persons who have no clue about the way that the industry functions dresses up hearsay and nonsense as fact and then dishes it out as advice to unsuspecting punters.
The cowboys in this industry don't need any help in furthering their disinformation and FUD - They've had enough experience in that field already.

Daniel306:There's not point in having a discussion with you at all.

That is your prerogative.

Daniel306:I asked if you had any evidence of speedtest.net giving erroneous results to which you replied that it's sponsored by NamesCo which insinuates that they would somehow skew the results to favour them (how I don't know?!?!?!?!).

First of all, my contribution in this regard insinuates nothing of the sort - That you imagine this is your problem and no-one elses.
Secondly, it is a simple matter to skew speed test results to favour a certain IP group or groups.

Daniel306:..... which is clearly not the case in my experience......

And that experience is?

Daniel306:Perhaps you would earn more credibility by not being so rude and dismissive in regards to ideas that other people present. After all this is a forum where people come for help, not to have their ideas dismissed and derided by yourself.

I will not aplogise for being dismissive of misleading and erroneous information! As for helping others I suggest that you peruse my contributions to this and other boards.

Daniel306:You also said that ISP's will always dismiss results produced while using speedtest.net which is clearly not the case in my experience.

According to your own admission, these test results were accepted by the BT group. Having worked at a very high level within the BT group, I can tell you now that you were fobbed off or simply lied to. It is official BT policy that the results from the BT speedtest alone are considered in any case. There are very good reasons for this that do not involve fraud or self interest.
Moreover, this policy and these reasons apply to all BT IPStream based ISPs although some less than honest providers will attempt to claim otherwise (See the reference to skewed results above).
If you don't believe this or require further clarification, search for the relevant SIN document.

Daniel306:Drop the attitude and try and be helpful rather than just being rude. Everyone can get along fine if we just play nice.

I get very annoyed when persons who have no clue about the way that the industry functions dresses up hearsay and nonsense as fact and then dishes it out as advice to unsuspecting punters.
The cowboys in this industry don't need any help in furthering their disinformation and FUD - They've had enough experience in that field already.

Dai Young:

Daniel306:It's not JUST sponsored by namesCo. Even though that is partly true that's not a basis for accusing namesco of somehow rigging the results.

And just where have I accused anyone of anything in this thread? You may gain more credibility if you learn to read what's actually in front of you before making inane accusations. I doubt it though given your obvious ignorance of the UK broadband provision industry.

 There's no point in having a discussion with you at all.

 I asked if you had any evidence of speedtest.net giving erroneous results to which you replied that it's sponsored by NamesCo which insinuates that they would somehow skew the results to favour them (how I don't know?!?!?!?!). Perhaps you would earn more credibility by not being so rude and dismissive in regards to ideas that other people present. After all this is a forum where people come for help, not to have their ideas dismissed and derided by yourself.

 You also said that ISP's will always dismiss results produced while using speedtest.net which is clearly not the case in my experience.

Drop the attitude and try and be helpful rather than just being rude. Everyone can get along fine if we just play nice.

Daniel306:It's not JUST sponsored by namesCo. Even though that is partly true that's not a basis for accusing namesco of somehow rigging the results.

And just where have I accused anyone of anything in this thread? You may gain more credibility if you learn to read what's actually in front of you before making inane accusations. I doubt it though given your obvious ignorance of the UK broadband provision industry.