To lofty and anyone else who has a problem with their Bank or a proposed Bank. Make a formal complaint. The Bank then have to deal with the complaint. If the Bank's response is unsatisfactory, then send on your complaint to the FS Ombudsman Service. Simply the threat of being reported to the Ombudsman is often sufficient to make these financial arrogant monoliths. Nationwide included. I have just been offered compensation for some problems I had with the Nationwide BS, but my problems were minor in comparison with some that I see reported on this and other sites.

Don't put up with bad service from anyone. Make formal Complaints and vote with your feet. If enough people made formal complaints, services would improve simply because these financial business models could not cope with a flood of complaints, nor would the FS Ombudsman Service be able to cope. As, happened recently at the Courts Service with the complaints and claims made for the rip-off charges being made by Banks, and Credit Cards and other financial services firms.

The Ombudsman Service have to make reports on how many people are making formal complaints. Storms of complaints do sometimes lead to changes in legislation punishing the offenders. The Banks and Financials also do not like being exposed to receiving a bad press, for some of the more outrageous rip-offs they've been involved with.

Make FORMAL COMPLAINTS, whenever a wrong is suffered or likely to be suffered by incorrect and/or arrogant behaviour.

I would advise against moving to Nationwide, they have a similar dismissive attitude to fraud. My account was scammed in June. I found out about it not from Nationwide, but from someone else who trades on the same auction site encouraging people to check their accounts after finding problems with her. I phoned the customer service number who gave me a number for the fraud department, who refused to speak to me because I had come through on the "wrong" line and refered me back to the call centre. Three hours and many phone calls later I tried the police, they told me that they only took an interest in things when they were reffered by the bank. When I finally did get through to some-one in fraud they dismissed it as "clerical error" and wanted to know what the problem was as I had not lost any money, because it had been refunded. She overlooked the fact that the building society must have incurred some sort of loss; and that as a member I am therefore inconvenienced. Four months later they are still shuffling money in and out of my account as charges and credits for these direct debits.

The most worrying thing is that they do not seem to have any security checks when direct debits are set up, they just assume they are genuine untill told otherwise. No wonder the Country is in such a mess when we trust these total incompetants with our money!

Regarding CrazyCatDD's comment about Shabby employees not admitting or accepting any mistakes; that is standard practice in the finance sector it is ALWAYS the customer's fault. I have only ever had one place I was happy entirely happy with National & Provincial Building Society, in 5 years they made 1 error on my accounts, which they acknowledged and sent me a letter of apology. (That has only happened to me once in over 20 years of dealing with the arrogant incompetants, who seem to be prevalant in the finance industry).

I applied for an Abbey Zero Credit Card at the start of September after I'd seen it and thought it was an excellent deal. However, it took a whole month after this to receive my card and be able to do a balance transfer, which was the reason I'd got the card in the first place. Therefore I incurred more interest from my existing credit card. Although this has been my only issue with Abbey to date, I do not believe that I should have to continually chase my application which is what I had to do and secondly it is just downright unacceptable that I should have to wait a month for this whole procedure to go through. I have applied for several credit cards in the past and done balance transfers on them and no-one else has ever kept me waiting a month to receive my card. In the past transactions have been dealt with very efficiently but this was not the case with Abbey. If it is down to the backlog which they claimed it was, they should maybe not offer such superb deals as they obviously can't take the pace!! I kept up my side of the bargain by sending back my terms and conditions signed immediately after I'd received them, so I don't want to hear anything from Abbey that they were waiting on my terms and conditions as this would be untrue. Some of the things I've read on this forum are a disgrace and I think what typifies the Abbey staff is a workforce who refuse to take any accountability for their actions and "nothing is their fault." I was thinking of changing my bank account to Abbey but I think I'll be thinking twice about that now.

The first step to solving the problems within Abbey is to identify them. If their own staff can't see that things are in need of improvements, there's not much hope of change. It should not take letters of complaint (are the problems our fault if we don't write them?) for a company to make the effort to train staff on the basics of how to deal with customers.

I would like to say that being one of the Abbey "investment representatives" discussed above, I have a very clear conscience and I help many people achieve their medium and long term goals on a daily basis. I love what I do and have worked hard to achieve the qualifications that I possess. In any industry you will get the rogues but Abbey has introduced (and is constanly introducing) very stringent Advice Quality policies. This means that it is becoming very difficult to do the types of things that you have described. People can protect themselves by reading the "suitability report" and all other paperwork that accompanies advice. Had you done so you would not have been "duped". Having said that - I understand your anger and had I been in your shoes I probably would have been irate as well.

With inflation being 4.4% - as a basic rate taxpayer you need to earn more than 5.5% on your money before you start earning a real rate of return. As a higher rate tax payer, you need to earn more than 7.3% before you start earning a real rate of return. As a financial consultant, you have no idea how frustrating it is to speak to people who simply will not understand the concept of making your money work hard for you. My questions is this: Why is my investments, which is in the same fund as my clients, not losing money? It has now been in there for 7 years and I constantly add when I can. Yes it is down at the moment but it will be back up. You've heard it before I am sure. You dont buy a house at a high price and sell low? Why would you do so with equities? Cash/Deposits have a very important part to play in a financial portfolio. The part though is small. Regular reviews not only keeps you up to date but also makes the adviser take ownership of their advice and the consequences thereof. Insist on it if it is not offered.

As for the system problems we as staff are just as frustrated as you the client. Having been bought by Santander and now being part of the 5th largest bank in the world, the transition to the very advanced Spanish system has been troublesome to say the least but once it is done, you will benefit from one of the most advanced bespoke systems in the industry. The way you were treated by angry staf is unacceptable and my clients are often surprised when I encourage a written complaint to our headoffice. It is the only way your voice counts. We are the keepers of YOUR money and I daresay you would have been well within your rights to question their anger. Demand to be treated as the person on who we rely to keep us going - We work for you and as such you should not step back.

Where financial strength is concerned I know who I would choose between Nationwide and Abbey/Santander - on another note - many people dont realise that they are covered under the Financial Services Compensation Scheme (FSCS) for the fist 35k of their cash and for a further 48k for investments and structured products. That effectively is 83k cover per person (166k per married couple).

I recently cancelled my subsription to a well known financial magazine because I came across so many articles that insinuated that the service that we provide as financial consultants for banks is somehow inferior to that provided by IFA's (Independant Financial Advisors). What a ridiculous notion... I deliver a better level of service than any IFA I know - and I know a few.

That is my 2 pence worth... (with future compounded growth it will be worth 12p)

I am a customer of abbey and have recently had endless annoying problems (they ALLWAYS have problems with the system) so everything seems to take forever to sort out. When I went in last summer to open a student account I figured it would have all been set up properly but no, it actually took until this summer to get the account set up properly after they lost my documents and rejection of an overdraught- standard with the account.

I would also be wary of going to abbey with large sums of money to invest- I was duped by one of their 'investment representatives' into opening a risky multi manager oeic and stocks and shares isa after being told there was no risk involved. It wasnt until I started to lose money that I realised something wasnt right. The person who sold me the investment had left the company (apparently) by the time I went to complain. Some people just don't have a conscience.

Frankly disgraceful. Vote with your feet, dump the Abbey. I have heard many other people make similar complaints and nothing is ever done until they try to leave.

Open an Online Account, with someone like the Nationwide, ask them to arrange to transfer all your funds and Direct Debits from the Abbey and to take over your entire Account from the Abbey and just close it, with your £1000, 900 or whatever else it is they seem to be having a glitch over intactly refunded into your Account.

Problem with them - report them to FSA Ombudsman and ask for compensation. I know it always happens at the most inconvenient time, but next time it could be even worse if they are so incompetent and then to boot, rude and ungrateful for your business as well!!

I moved away from Abbey to Nationwide a few years ago although swmbo didn't want to close the Abby account so it's still there with a few pounds in it.

The last straw was when we were living in New Zealand and I wanted to pay in a few cheques, including one for US$7k. I phoned up and kept being told that I needed to fill in a form for the $ cheque and this form would be sent to me. I was told this on several occasions but the form never arrived. Then, one day, the person that I spoke to said that I could just post them the cheque and they'd sort things out at their end. So I posted the $ cheque with some other £ cheques. The other cheques went into my account but the $ cheque didn't. They then claimed never to have received it! That lie really annoyed me. Anyway, after making many angry phone calls and pulling out a lot of hair, the $ cheque arrived in the post in New Zealand about 4 months later with a second class stamp on the envelope and the right form inside.

They might change their ways one day but, for the time being, I reckon we are both doing the right thing in looking to bank elsewhere.

Paying some money into my account yesterday (Saturday), I thought I'd grab a mini statement while I was there. The balance was considerably less than I was expecting, and when I read the mini statement more closely, I noticed that a standing order for just under £1000 (that's ONE THOUSAND POUNDS) had left my account the previous day via some rogue standing order.

I queried this with one of the staff, who looked on her system, and said it was a mistake on Abbey's part, and that I'd just need to cancel it with the call centre staff, and it would all be OK.

Despite her claims that it was Abbey's fault, she didn't offer to ring the call centre staff for me, but directed my to one of the in branch phones.

I then spent about thirty five minutes hanging on the phone - about five minutes of this was spent actually talking to someone (actually three different someones). The first person I spoke to cancelled the original rogue standing order, then identified another one, for £980, so he cancelled that as well. I mentioned what the woman in the branch said, about it being a glitch on Abbey's system, but he didn't seem to know, and suggested that he put me through to the fraud dept.

The phone rang and rang. Then rang a bit more. Then rang again. Eventually, someone answered it, but it wasn't the fraud dept- I'd been re- transferred back to the first level call centre. I asked the woman to put me through to the fraud dept - she transferred the call, and it rang several times before cutting itself off.

Had just re- dialled when a member of staff walked past, on her way to another part of the office. I collared her, gave a brief explanation of what had happened, and asked if she could help me - she asked me to wait a moment, then continued walking through to the other part of the office - I returned to my ringing phone.

Eventually got through to some other call centre bod who:-

(a) wasn't sure whether the original 1000 pounds had left my account or not- despite it showing on my mini statement. He eventually decided that it had and

(b) wasn't sure whether he could put me through to fraud or not. eventually he decided that he could, but gave me their direct line number, just in case we got cut off. He said that, as it was saturday, they would be closing down at 1pm (it was now about 12.15).

He transferred the call, which rang continuously for a couple of mins before cutting itself off. I'd simultaneously dialled the direct line he'd given me on my mobile, and it had gone straight through to a voicemail, saying that the office was closed until monday.

I was now rather stressed and, spotting the member of staff I'd spoken to earlier, went and collared her and asked her for help. She seemed very angry, and asked why I hadn't spoken to her earlier when she'd asked me to (she hadn't - she'd been on her way to another part of the office, I hadn't seen her come back through, poss cos I was on the phone, and she hadn't come and spoken to me). She said she was now just about to go home.

Anyway, she looked me up on her computer and at that point, the first member of staff I'd spoken to came and joined in. She also seemed to be angry with me, saying that she had told me it was a glitch, it had happened to lots of other people, and that she'd told me my account would be corrected automatically on Monday. Agreed, she'd told me it was a glitch, but she'd seemed quite casual about it- I consider a thousand pounds to be a significant amount of money to go missing, and a little concerned that they didn't seem more concerned. Or sympathetic.

They rang the fraud dept, who took my phone number, and said they would ring me back. They said that as it was such a large amount of money, they would put a freeze on my account. Before they did that, the member of staff in my local branch asked if I'd like to withdraw any cash - I accepted. She said that they had all cashed up,and mentioned something about a branch in another part of London being open until 4pm. Although she stopped short of actually asking me to go to the other branch I think that was the inference.

She then went over to the cash desk, returning a few mins later with the cash I'd asked for. Again, she seemed really angry with me, saying that the cashiers were furious, as they'd all cashed up and I'd messed up their records. I pointed out that the situation hadn't actually been my fault, to which she replied that it wasn't their fault either.

Needless to say, the fraud people haven't phoned me back, and I now have a frozen bank account, four days before I'm due to fly out for a two week holiday in thailand. The holiday money isn't an issue, thankfully, as all sorted before this happened. I'm annoyed that if it isn't sorted out straight away, I'll have to spend the next two- three days intensively phoning the gas and electricity boards to try and sort out alternative methods of payment for them while I'm away. Two questions, tho:-

1. First woman I spoke to said that a similar thing had been happening to other customers. Is this true? Anyone else experienced rogue standing orders on their accounts recently, and were they resolved?

2. Why do they have to be so sodding rude? Yes I know it was saturday and they all wanted to *** off home, but I didn't get an ounce of sympathy.

this is the third major problem I've had with abbey in the space of 12 months, and have now made a start on changing my bank.

Apologies is this is a little long winded, but I'm still really annoyed, and wanted to let off steam!!!