Hi backfoot,

Okay got today's wages in the bag !

It is great if you can get in at the low but it is a huge guessing game, When I used to trade single well known shares like Te**o, I looked at their charts and moving average and would buy up to £20k worth if I felt positive. I was a firm believer of monitoring the share price a few times each day on the laptop and moving up my stop loss price but never moving it down.

Sometimes I got "tripped out" (share price dips and deal closed) but each time I took my profit. I pulled out of share dealing in June last year after doing a lot of research into CFD's and Financial Spread Betting and taking some lessons on technical analysis (charting).

Binary betting is a form of spread betting but is actually a type of fixed odds bet that can be started and finished at any time up to 1 minute before market close. The price range on an Index bet is between 0 and 100. 0 means index has finished lower than previous day's close and 100 means it has finished higher. There is always a spread in the buy sell price of 3 or 4 points, this being the spread betting companies profit.

I normally look to place my bet if sell price is between 5 and 20, near end of session and chart indicators are looking good. Alternatively to place buy bet if price is between 80 and 95. I cannot take my eyes off the screen for even 5 seconds during some trades as the market has been volatile lately, Friday I made 16 times my stake in less than 2 minutes on DJ index near the end of session. Today FTSE was very calm and made money easily without the old ticker racing too much !

I bet between £1 and £10 a point depending on how cofident I feel, sometimes no bet at all.

Now the warning: If I place a sell bet at 20, and the index rises and finishes UP on previous day's close then I could theoretically lose 80 points (80 times my stake) However, I have strict stop loss rules which mean I will close a bet and take a loss if index is going wrong way, and price goes through or appears to be going through support level on bad economic data. It is better to take a 15 or 20 point loss than an 80 point loss if I froze and watched in horror as my bet went completely the wrong way. (I actually experienced this a couple of times in the early days)

In spread betting it is estimated that only 2 out of 10 traders make a profit through the first year but Binary betting to me is less risky as long as I concentrate fully on my charts and listen to any economic news on CNBC, Bloomberg etc

I have losing bets mainly with small stakes of £1 a point which I close and normally get that lost money back and a bit oif profit on top nearer the end of session, but very occasionally can take a bigger loss which can take a week to get back with sensible bets. One must never chase big losses, too dangerous.

With regards to MS share price and credit/housing related shares and funds getting hammered, the whole economy has taken a huge hit and is not out of trouble yet. Saying this, I have still put my money where my mouth is and invested into a regular savings scheme into 4 unit trusts and an investment trust together with a reasonable lump sum on 22 October. I am expecting to show a profit by Christmas but also am aware that another retest of the market lows could occur between now and end of January. With unit trusts being a longer term view for me I am investing monthly and looking at a minimum 3 to 5 year term for my regular monthly investments. Although I am in early retirement, it spices up the boring but safe (?) savings a bit by investing 10% into stock market again.

I cannot comment on a particular share such as MS.com as I have never followed this sort of share. If as expected markets rebound well over next few years then it will possibly rise by a bigger %age than the FTSE all share index but I will stick to binary betting for my risky side of investments.

Good luck anyway if you are invested...

Hi Backfoot,

Good to see someone making a profit.

I am getting ready for today's (possible) binary bet on FTSE index at the mment so will post a more detailed reply after FTSE close.

Cheers

ATM

ATM,

I was being ironic ....:-). Good timing though, from the former owner !!

The 19 % rise is still 19% if you bought in at the low. Each percentage is just as valuable to a new purchase.I understand exactly what you are saying about a share held throughout the term like the OP has obviously done.

I haven't heard of binary betting and don't want to get into it.Can you explain how it can be just as risky....but more profits/losses?

Anyway back to the original question,will they go lower?

Possibly,as they face stiff competiton,a lack of mortgage/loan business and the risk to those factors due to a deepening recession.The point about share valuations at any one time is not just being aware of these things, but knowing to what extent they are built into the current price and how the market values them.There is also the factors about sentiment which MS will be subject to.

Anything connected with credit/housing has been hammered.The bubble burst.

A share for the brave only in my opinion.

backfoot,

all about timing, that's what the tech stock investors (follow the herd lot) didn't listen to in early 2000.....

Just using sample figures here as I don't trade individual shares,

Share price £1......after 80% drop = 20p.........then after subsequent 19% rise = 23.8p.........ouch still not much good for the wallet.

If anyone likes the thrill of investing in risky shares, they should try "binary betting / trading" on the FTSE or DJ indices...... just as risky but much more profits (or losses if you don't follow common sense trading rules)

This only matters if you are thinking about cashing in your shares ... if not - why look? ive seen my shares in HBOS go from £10 to 63p..... but i rekon they will go up wit all this mystery speculation on a new buyer.

golden rule - dont invest what you cant afford to lose. i was given the shares and didnt purchase them so i will make 100% profit whatever way :)

PeterA

Were you interested or involved in stocks around 1999 / 2000 when the techs & telecoms bubble inflated and burst......

I could not invest in risky single shares like MS, in either a bull or a bear market. If you are invested, too late to pull out now and just hope for a recovery,

Risky shares are for speculators only, it is a gamble like betting on an outsider in a horse race.

How much lower do people anticipate the MS.com share price will go?

A 33% saving on car insurance maybe... but an 80% loss in share value is disturbing.